Uncle Phaedrus, Finder of Lost Recipes (2024)

From: Donna Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 12:33 PMTo: phaedrus@hungrybrowser.com Subject: authentic Schrafft's hot fudge recipe Did you ever find the long version (Julia Child cited it and printed it in McCall's magazine) I believe.

Hi Donna,

First, I want to make it clear that it’s not at all certain as to what the “authentic” recipe actually was. There are a half dozen recipes posted on the web that claim to be the authentic recipe. I have two here:3-30-09

There is a book called “When Everybody Ate at Schrafft’s” by Joan Kanel Stomanson, in which the descendants of the founder and owner of Schrafft’s, Frank G. Shattuck, give the recipe that has been handed down in their family. See below for that one.

Finally, there is the claim that Julia Child, in her column in McCall’s Magazine in 1980 - 81, let it be known that she was seeking the “authentic” recipe. She received and published nine recipes that were sent to her by readers, but she was not happy with any of them. Finally, she was sent a recipe from “GG” – someone claiming to be a former Schrafft’s employee. This recipe made 3 1/2 quarts and appears to have involved making Schrafft’s butterscotch or caramel sauce first, then adding cocoa or chocolate or both to make the hot fudge sauce. The New York Times mentioned this in a brief article: The Great Chocolate Sauce Mystery

It’s also mentioned here: Chowhound

and here:

Google Books

Other than Julia’s liking this recipe, there is not a lot of reason to favor it over the Shattuck family’s recipe as being the “authentic” recipe. The really odd thing to me about this recipe, is that although it was printed in a national magazine, the recipe is not to be found anywhere on the web.

Since McCall’s is a national magazine, it is possible to obtain back issues, and that might be the best way to get this recipe. There are a couple of websites that sell such back issues: E-Bay, of course, and backissues.com. The problem is in knowing which particular issue the Schrafft’s recipe is to be found. On this message board: Recipeland, someone says: I have page 52 of McCall's May 1981 containing the first part of "Schrafft's Authentic" Hot Fudge Sauce number 11, but it is continued on page 54 which I can't find.

The problem with that statement is that the above referenced New York Times article is dated April 16, 1981, yet it refers to the recipe as already (in the past) having being printed in Julia's column. So it's unclear to which recipe the article is referring - it's apparently not the recipe published in May, 1981.

Anyhow, you can buy the May, 1981 issue of McCall’s here: Back Issues

Other issues are available there and on Ebay.

Phaed

Schrafft’s Hot Fudge Sauce (Shattuck Family Recipe)1 stick (1/4 lb) unsalted butter3 squares unsweetened chocolate1 cup sugarpinch of salt 1 cup heavy cream1 tsp. vanilla extract1. Melt butter, chocolate, and sugar in top of double boiler with very hot water in the lower part of the boiler2. Stir when melted , then add cream and salt and stir again. Let this cook for 2 hours in top of double boiler over hot water, taking care that the water doesn’t boil out.3. Remove from heat and stir in vanilla. Sauce thickens when it cools or when put on ice cream. Can be refrigerated. At serving time, reheat in top of double boiler over hot water.================================================================

Hi Donna,

I contacted one of my consultants, who has access to some things that I don’t. She was able to obtain the below recipe, which appears to be the two-part sauce.

Phaed

Hi Phaedrus,The caramel sauce is also noted here: Google BooksCaramel Sauce – "Schrafft's Authentic" Yield: About 1 2/3 cups2/3 cup sugar2/3 cup dark brown sugar1/8 teaspoon salt 1/2 cup white corn syrup (in a 1 cup measure) 1/3 cup hot water 1/2 cup heavy cream 1/3 cup milk, plus droplets more, if needed Set a 4 cup measure with 1 1/2 cup cold water by your side, for testingthe syrup as it boils. Blend the 2 sugars and the salt in the saucepan.Measure the corn syrup into the pan; then rinse its cup with the 1/3 cuphot water, and add to the pan. Bring to a boil, swirling pan by itshandle; remove from heat, and swirl and stir until you are sure sugarshave dissolved completely (very important, to prevent the syrup fromcrystallizing later.) Set over high heat, cover the pan (steam condensing under cover willwash sugar crystals down side of pan) and boil for 2 to 3 minutes, oruntil bubbles are thick and syrupy. Uncover pan, and stand right overthe syrup while it continues to boil to 290 degrees F, the hard-crackstage. Remove from heat and let cool several minutes, until it stops bubbling.Then in a thin stream, dribble and blend in the 1/2 cup of cream. Bringagain to the boil, and continue boiling, uncovered, to 260 degrees F,the very-hard-ball stage. Remove from the heat, and let cool untilbubbling has stopped; dribble and blend in the 1/3 cup of milk. Bring toa rolling boil, uncovered, from 3 to 4 seconds. Remove from heat. Stir occasionally as the sauce cools, to prevent itfrom settling or lumping; it should be a smooth, heavy syrup. Store in the refrigerator in a covered jar. To serve, warm in a saucepanuntil liquefied. If too thick for your taste, thin with droplets of milkor water. Sauce is usually served tepid. Hot Fudge Sauce "Schrafft's Authentic" Yield: About 1 1/3 cups1 cup of the Caramel Sauce – "Schrafft's Authentic"2 Tablespoons butter 4 cup unsweetened cocoa, in a 1 cup measure 3 Tablespoons milk 2 teaspoons vanilla extract1 additional Tablespoon butter Boil the caramel sauce and 2 Tablespoons butter to 245 degrees F, thefirm-ball stage. Remove from heat. Blend the cocoa in its cup with themilk. When perfectly smooth and when caramel is no longer bubbling,blend the chocolate into the caramel, and bring to the full rolling boilfor 3 to 4 seconds. Remove from heat; beat in the vanilla and Tablespoonbutter. Store in a covered jar in the refrigerator. When ready to serve, heateither in a saucepan or put the jar in boiling water until sauce is warmand liquid. If too thick or stiff, beat in droplets of water. If while you are boiling the syrup and it goes beyond the particularstage you are after you can stir in droplets of water to dilute thesolution, and start over again.Schrafft’s Stringy Caramel And Hot Fudge Sauces Caramel Sauce 2 /3 cup each white and dark brown sugars 1 /8 tsp. salt 1/2 cup white corn syrup 1/3 cup hot water 1/2 cup heavy cream 1/3 cup milk, plus more if needed In a heavy saucepan, blend the two sugars and the salt. Measure the corn syrup into the pan; then rinse its cup with the 1/3 cup hot water and add it to the pan. Bring to the boil, swirling pan by its handle; remove from heat, and swirl and stir until the sugars are completely dissolved. (Very important, to prevent the syrup from crystallizing later.) Set over high heat, cover the pan, and boil for 2 to 3 minutes, or until the bubbles are thick and syrupy. Uncover the pan and continue to boil the syrup until it reaches the hard-crack stage (290° ). (Note: Test the syrup at various stages by dribbling a little into ice water and forming the dribbles into balls with your fingers.) Remove from heat and let cool several minutes, until it stops bubbling. Then, in a thin stream, dribble in and blend the 1/2 cup of cream. Bring to the boil again and continue boiling, uncovered, to the very-hard-ball stage (260°). Remove from heat, let cool until the bubbling has stopped, and dribble and blend in the 1/3 cup of milk. Bring to a rolling boil, uncovered, for 3 to 4 seconds, and remove from heat. Stir occasionally as it cools; it should be a smooth, heavy syrup. Store in the refrigerator. To serve, warm in a saucepan until it liquifies. If it is too thick, thin it with a little more milk. Makes about 1 2 /3 cups. Hot Fudge Sauce 1 cup of the caramel sauce 3 Tbs. butter ¼ cup unsweetened cocoa 3 Tbs. milk 2 tsp. vanilla Combine the caramel sauce with 2 Tbs. of the butter and cook to the firm-ball stage (245°). Remove from heat and let cool until it stops bubbling. Mix the cocoa with the milk until it is very smooth and blend the mix into the caramel sauce. Bring to a full rolling boil for 3 to 4 seconds. Remove from the heat and beat in the vanilla and the last Tbs. of butter. Store and serve like the caramel sauce. If it is too thick on re-heating, thin with a little milk. Makes about 1 1/3 cupsPlease let me know if this is what you were seeking!Best,Gwen==========================================================Wow. You are amazing. One of those must be the one. I am going to set aside an afternoon and give it a go. Best,Donna 

From: marthaSent: Thursday, September 17, 2015 2:59 PMTo: phaedrus@hungrybrowser.com Subject: Peaco*ck's steak baste Years ago (maybe 20) I used Peaco*ck's Steak Baste . Wonderful stuff.Any ideas?

Hello Martha,

Sorry, I found only a few brief mentions of Peaco*ck’s Steak Baste – no recipes, no descriptions, and no list of ingredients.

Peaco*ck's was a trademark of Carter Products, Inc., who got out of any sort of food business and into strictly pharmaceuticals years ago.

There is a steak baste recipe below, but I have no idea if it is similar to Peaco*ck’s.

Phaed

Steak Baste 1 c. soy sauce2 lg. onions, coarsely chopped1/4 c. Kitchen Bouquet (or other browning sauce)2 tbsp. chopped garlic1 tbsp. olive oil2 tsp. Italian seasoning mixCombine all ingredients in electric blender or food processor. Whirl 1 minute. Store baste in covered jar in refrigerator. To use - spread on both sides of steak and broil or barbeque as usual.

From: Linda Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2015 4:31 PMTo: phaedrus@hungrybrowser.com Subject: Dill Pickle Recipe From 1942 Cookbook???Hello - What a fantastic site you have! I'm so glad to have found it!I'm trying to find a dill pickle recipe. After 50 years - yes, really, 50 YEARS!!! - I finally found a homemade pickle just like the ones I used to love - back when I was a teenager. A little old lady with gray hair was selling pint jars of her dill pickles - and they just 'looked' like they should be good. I got a jar, and wow! It was the taste that I had been looking for! When I went back to buy two more jars (at $5 a pint!), I asked if she would share the recipe - but she declined - although she did say she had gotten the recipe from a 1942 cookbook that had been in the Rolla, MO public library.I tried to find a cookbook that old at the library, and of course they didn't still have it. The (young) librarian said they didn't list anything by publication date - and I had to search their (meager) shelves for something that looked old enough to be "the one".... but no luck. Since this is a fairly rural area (in the Ozarks), I assume that the 1942 cookbook might have been one of the fairly popular cookbooks of the time - maybe one that concentrated on canning and preserving, though it may have contained all sorts of recipes - maybe even a church cookbook. Who knows?These pickles are just like the "Paramount" brand of hot dill pickles that my sister and I used to eat when we had 'dill pickle eating contests'. ( lol! They are NOT the crispy cucumbery type of dill like most of the Vlasik products. They are pleasingly crisp-to-tender, a darker olive green in color, and a good amount of dill flavor, as well as a good balance of salt and vinegar. There are more similar in texture to sliced hamburger dills but not quite as salty - just a bit more 'mellow'. After the Paramount dills (sold by IGA grocery stores in Oklahoma) were no longer produced, the Schweggman grocery stores in New Orleans carried them, and Schweggman went out of business. (I used to buy a case of pickles every time we visited these areas - to keep in my 'stash'. ;D )From what I see in the jar of pickles, it looks like there is nothing there except dill weed, along with some jalapeno slices at the top for a little heat. The lady makes them with and without the jalapenos - and back in 1942, I'll bet the recipe just said to add a 'hot pepper'. There might be a touch of garlic, but it is not very predominant.I found some recipes that I thought might be similar, here: Old Recipe Book But, it would be nice if I could find the original recipe!.......especially since I now have about 4 dozen pickling size cucumbers that I just bought - thinking that I would find the recipe at the library! ;DAny help you can give would be greatly appreciated!Linda

Hello Linda,

I’m afraid all of your clues lead me only to dead ends.

Too bad you didn’t get the name of the 1942 cookbook from that lady. If you had, we might be able to track down a copy of it. I searched through the Rolla, MO’s Public Libraries online card catalog at Rolla, MO’s Public Libraries online card catalog, but I did not find a cookbook or canning book with a 1942 publication date. They may not even have the book anymore.There must have been dozens of cookbooks and canning books published in 1942. There are several on EBay: EBay

This blogger says she has a copy of the 1942 edition of “The Modern Family Cook Book” by Meta Givens that has a dill pickle recipe in it. If you write to her, she might send it to you: Meta's Meals. If you do write to her, and she does send it to you, please e-mail me a copy of the recipe.

Paramount Pickles was bought out by Dean Foods and the Paramount brand was discontinued in 1995. I could not find any copycat or tastes-like recipes for any of Paramount’s pickles.

Your recipe, or one like it, may be on the web, but there is no way for me to find it without information about the specific cookbook or recipe: the name of the cookbook, or the name of the pickles(if unique). Your description makes the pickles sound quite tasty, but descriptions like that are not helpful in identifying the “original recipe”, which is what you request.

I have a 1947 cookbook called “The United States Regional Cookbook” edited by Ruth Berlotzheimer that has a Pennsylvania Dutch dill pickle recipe in it from that era. See below.

This is about the best I can do without the name of that 1942 cookbook or a unique name for that type of dill pickle, if there is one. I’ll post this on my site. Perhaps a reader can help.

Phaed

Dill Pickles10 quarts water2 cups salt1 quart vinegar4 tablespoons pepper1 - 1/2 pecks of cucumbers5 stalks of dillMake a solution of the first 4 ingredients and bring to a boil.Fill crock with cucumbers, placing dill between layers of cucumbers. Add hot solution. A slice of onion of garlic may be added to the boiling liquid, if desired. Cover crock and let stand several days before using. If preferred, cucumbers may be preserved in jars rather than in a crock.Makes about 3 gallons.======================================================================Hello Phaedrus - Thank you so much for your quick reply. I will contact the lady who has the 1942 cookbook, and keep my fingers crossed that it is the recipe I am looking for. I will certainly forward a copy of the recipe to you - whether it is "the one", or not - so you will have it on record.I was surprised to see that you could search Rolla Library's card index - tomorrow I'll contact the library's Director (who I have spoken to previously, as I am donating many books to the library that I don't have room to keep - but they will keep them 'for me' -- cookbooks, books on gardening, sewing, quilting, etc - all quality books that are invaluable for researching many topics.) Perhaps she can dig out actual index cards from 'the old days', and find the name of the book.I had a pretty good idea that the info on the Paramount pickles, etc., wouldn't help much - but sometimes that 'rings a bell' with a person and your brain's 'bulb' lights up. I was interesting to learn what happened to Paramount, though --- what a shame! (for pickle lovers!) ;DI will go to the Farmer's Market next week - and see if the little old lady will give me the book's name....Fingers crossed! ;DThank you very much!Linda===================================================================Hello Phaedrus - On the continuing search for the dill pickle recipe:I checked the blog site - and am awaiting a reply from the blogger about the pickle recipe. It appears that - if it is the 'right' recipe, that it appeared in "The Modern Family Cook Book" pub 1942. This was a very popular cookbook, and was updated many times. I have asked the Library of Congress if they can check to see if this recipe was in later editions - which might be in better reading/using shape than the couple on www.bookfinder.com that have the 1942 publ date. The blogger has been making recipes from this old cook book, and says some are really great - and others are really bad! I guess WW II forced people to make use and make do - especially in strange food combinations. ;DMeanwhile - as a curious coincidence - I contacted the Director of the Rolla Public Library - because I am donating a number of quilting, sewing, cooking, gardening, etc books to them - and asked about the 1942 records. Of course, they are gone - they went when the whole system was sold, cards and all, after the library computerized.However, (in the 'Isn't it a Small World' category), it turns out that the lady is VERY familiar with Paramount pickles! Seems her grandmother (in Grant County, OK) used to make dill pickles - but if she HAD to buy 'store bought', it was always the Paramount brand! We had fun reminiscing about pickles and 'old time cooking'....and she remembered that she thought she might still have either a copy of the pickle recipe, or the book itself. She is going to dig out the information as soon as possible, but since she will be out of town, it might be 2 wks or so before I hear back from her.Linda=================================================================Hello Uncle Phaedrus, Thanks for the good recipe sleuthing you continue to do!I just read the 1942 dill pickle saga and immediately thought of the Woman's Home Companion cookbook. My mother had this cookbook as a young bride and handed her copy off to me years ago. I checked - it was first published in 1942 and reprinted without changes (except the binding) in 1946. Apparently in 1942 there were two best-selling cookbooks, the Modern Family Cookbook being the other one. I'd put equal money on the pickle recipe being in Woman's Home Companion.Mom's/mine is this edition: AmazonThere was also this one (better book info here): Vintage CookbookDon't know where my copy is at the moment, but if I spot it I'll take a look for dill pickles. Best,Jennie